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Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
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Posted - 2014.11.04 00:10:45 -
[1] - Quote
ll Kuray ll wrote:
This is tough, how many times do i need to says its a lot easier today to not feel the consequence. gank someone in high sec 5 years ago and you're out in null sec ratting for 5 days to make the isk back, now you run incursions, run a few level 5's in a carrier that you can also afford. If anything Gankers are just as guilty at being lazy. It's nothing to do with smart game play.
I remember a glorious stage (about 5 years ago) where a certain T1 battleruiser was selling on the open market for less than the insurance payout + insurance premium. Please explain to me how there are less consequences today than back when I could gank, lose my ship to concord, collect insurance, dock up buy a new hull, fit it identically, spin ship for a few minutes and do it again.
You sir are looking at history in rose coloured glasses and only seeing the bits you want. |

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Posted - 2014.11.04 00:23:49 -
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Veers Belvar wrote:Cancel Align NOW wrote:ll Kuray ll wrote:
This is tough, how many times do i need to says its a lot easier today to not feel the consequence. gank someone in high sec 5 years ago and you're out in null sec ratting for 5 days to make the isk back, now you run incursions, run a few level 5's in a carrier that you can also afford. If anything Gankers are just as guilty at being lazy. It's nothing to do with smart game play.
I remember a glorious stage (about 5 years ago) where a certain T1 battleruiser was selling on the open market for less than the insurance payout + insurance premium. Please explain to me how there are less consequences today than back when I could gank, lose my ship to concord, collect insurance, dock up buy a new hull, fit it identically, spin ship for a few minutes and do it again. You sir are looking at history in rose coloured glasses and only seeing the bits you want. The difference is that you never had a large group of players with a significant SRP who sit in highsec all day, every day, suicide ganking people. It's not the mechanics that have changed, it's the desire of a large swath of the nullsec playerbase to try and make highsec uninhabitable for new/casual players.
Again with the rose tinted inaccurate history. In 2008,2009,2010 the 0.0 corp I belonged to had a month long internal mining ship hunting competition. The desire to create something that struck fear and rage into the hearts of others has always been there.
0.0 players are not trying to hurt new players. The fact a heavily weighted CSM has agreed with the awoxing change put forward by a 0.0 leader is pretty clear evidence to the contrary.
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Posted - 2014.11.04 00:53:00 -
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Haleuth wrote:Veers Belvar wrote:
The difference is that you never had a large group of players with a significant SRP who sit in highsec all day, every day, suicide ganking people. It's not the mechanics that have changed, it's the desire of a large swath of the nullsec playerbase to try and make highsec uninhabitable for new/casual players.
You dont know what your talking about, macrointel was the organisation that preceded code way back in 2006 and our brutix's and fittings were paid for by nullsec alliances/t2 BPO holders.
Thanks for the reminder Haleuth.
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Posted - 2014.11.04 00:55:50 -
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Veers Belvar wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Can anyone else figure out why Veers so relentlessly wants to grief new players by savaging their comparative income? I know...it's crazy....he wants to make them able to generate income in highsec without blowing up as much....there is nothing more likely to drive them into bankruptcy and out of the game. I guess he is just one of those Goon alts who wants to squash any potential competition. Lucky we have others, like CODE, who do everything the can to make the game enjoyable for new players and encourage them to stay in the game. 
You love run away inflation?
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Posted - 2014.11.04 01:04:48 -
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Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Cancel Align NOW wrote:Veers Belvar wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Can anyone else figure out why Veers so relentlessly wants to grief new players by savaging their comparative income? I know...it's crazy....he wants to make them able to generate income in highsec without blowing up as much....there is nothing more likely to drive them into bankruptcy and out of the game. I guess he is just one of those Goon alts who wants to squash any potential competition. Lucky we have others, like CODE, who do everything the can to make the game enjoyable for new players and encourage them to stay in the game.  You love run away inflation? Which, remember, only the already rich can really gain from. Yeah, he wants to ruin the lives of new players.
Maybe I should support Veer's madness and then just start relisting in Jita.
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Posted - 2014.11.04 01:10:23 -
[6] - Quote
Imagine those poor newbies mining for months on end in their ventures to earn their first Retriever. |

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Posted - 2014.11.04 01:22:40 -
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Ran my first ever maze back in 06/07? with 3 other relative newbies. We got enough to each buy a 60 day GTC. |

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Posted - 2014.11.04 01:24:46 -
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Some Rando wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Cancel Align NOW wrote:Imagine those poor newbies mining for months on end in their ventures to earn their first Retriever. If you think about purchasing power now, compared to five years ago, that's not too extreme of a supposition. It makes buying a PLEX for sale pretty much mandatory, which means more money for CCP...
So subscription plus mandatory plex. I see that being a great selling point to new players.
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Posted - 2014.11.04 07:39:13 -
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Veers Belvar wrote:
Sorry, was laughing too hard at this part. I believe that reasoned discourse is an important part of Eve, and debated CODE on their in game minerbumping channel until they banned, and until a couple of weeks ago was on the in game BU channel until Arden banned me for refusing to join/support CODE. 90% of the time there was spent either watching people engaged in petty fights in chat with each other, or suspect baiting mission runners, etc... The idea that they have either the manpower or the resources to light highsec on fire is, quite simply, laughable.
Yet you campaign vigorously for their removal/nerfing/punishment. You should stand for CSM 10. Please post promotional videos on Youtube. |

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Posted - 2014.11.04 19:41:39 -
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Veers Belvar wrote:
lolz...punishing criminals by putting them in jail is a form of protection for society as it prevents them from committing more crimes. The GCC timer protects all of highsec from the ganker...duh.
The GCC is to stop people from escaping concord. It used to be possible to evade them. They buffed concord to "impossible to evade" status, then in a nerf to ganking made evading concord an official exploit. By introducing the 15 minute GCC (another nerf to ganking) they are tying up loose ends. This game has many bugs - players are adept at finding bugs and using/exploiting them for their own ends. With a 15 minute GCC you can not bounce around local evading concords attack. |

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Posted - 2014.11.04 20:35:38 -
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Veers Belvar wrote:Cancel Align NOW wrote:Veers Belvar wrote:
lolz...punishing criminals by putting them in jail is a form of protection for society as it prevents them from committing more crimes. The GCC timer protects all of highsec from the ganker...duh.
The GCC is to stop people from escaping concord. It used to be possible to evade them. They buffed concord to "impossible to evade" status, then in a nerf to ganking made evading concord an official exploit. By introducing the 15 minute GCC (another nerf to ganking) they are tying up loose ends. This game has many bugs - players are adept at finding bugs and using/exploiting them for their own ends. With a 15 minute GCC you can not bounce around local evading concords attack. Because the only way to ensure ship loss was to force the guy to sit for 15 minutes not for 2 minutes  . Come on.
Sitting for 2 minutes can be explained away as lagged under tidi in a petition to GMs - 15 minutes was deemed enough time for the GCC subject to know they had escaped concord and were consciously and deliberately evading them.
Learn some history.
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Posted - 2014.11.04 20:39:48 -
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Veers Belvar wrote:
It would be trivial to code things to make evading CONCORD an exploit
Explain how so? Removing the ability for a pilot to warp without an active warp disruption module breaks the oldest coding in the game. |

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Posted - 2014.11.05 00:28:59 -
[13] - Quote
Jack dannels wrote:
haha becoming to safe that's a joke empire has more lost ships per day then all of low sec and nullie combined safe space is 0.0
That is because the players have made it safe for themselves using current mechanics. Why don't you do the same? |

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Posted - 2014.11.05 20:00:21 -
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La Rynx wrote:
if the content includes continuing humiliation of other players and try to force them to aggressive behaviour. (griefing) is not content that any gaming platform requires. The game might be a sandbox, but that is not an invitation to some players to poo into the sandbox, because this small group thinks this is funny and to make poo in a sandbox is only natural.
So other players might feel disgusted, even when they never fell into this poo and want a stop to this kind of behaviour.
Your analogy proves why Eve is a game that has a long history and stickability. Any player can poop where ever they want, they just have to wear the consequences.
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Posted - 2014.11.06 00:01:29 -
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Lucas Kell wrote:Cancel Align NOW wrote:La Rynx wrote:
if the content includes continuing humiliation of other players and try to force them to aggressive behaviour. (griefing) is not content that any gaming platform requires. The game might be a sandbox, but that is not an invitation to some players to poo into the sandbox, because this small group thinks this is funny and to make poo in a sandbox is only natural.
So other players might feel disgusted, even when they never fell into this poo and want a stop to this kind of behaviour.
Your analogy proves why Eve is a game that has a long history and stickability. Any player can poop where ever they want, they just have to wear the consequences. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, bull. Consequences is something EVE seriously lacks in a lot of aspects. Ganking is definitely one of those aspects.
Sec status removal. Insurance voiding. Guaranteed ship loss. Trade-able Kill rights. GCC.
These are consequences. Just like the consequence for flying a poorly fit ship in space with too much dropable gear on board is an infinitesimal chance of getting ganked.
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Posted - 2014.11.06 00:08:20 -
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Lucas Kell wrote:Counter ganking efforts are ridiculed because there is no good way to execute them. There is absolutely nothing you can do to a ganker to disrupt them because the whole character is effectively disposable.
As for chasing their donators, if you can find ones that aren't just alts, it's unlikely you'd be able to do much to disrupt anything. Chances are you would spend more time and isk than they ever have on their handful of cheap catalysts.
300m is pocket change, you can make that by breakfast, and compared the the masses of grinding that used to be required, it's barely a shadow of the effort that it used to take. That's to completely take yourself from career ganker to flying without even a red highlight on your name.
There are a number of ways to avoid being ganked as illustrated numerous times in numerous threads and on numerous forums. There are also active workable ways to get back at the gankers.
There is where you lose credibility as a competent Eve Player. Knowledge is power. You take to whining on the forums while others learn their options, put them into practice and live happiliy in high sec doing missions, market trading, couriering and mining with little to no loses.
If ganking were truly imbalanced, Jita would be empty as goods could not get in out. If ganking were truly imbalanced ice prices in empire would so high that capital travel would grind to halt.
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Posted - 2014.11.06 00:48:04 -
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Veers Belvar wrote:
Except that the killboards are full of players getting ganked, especially new/casual players, and many respond by just quitting the game because they don't enjoy getting curbstomped. Much like the awoxxing mechanics, the easy proliferation of suicide ganking in highsec materially harms player retention.
The killboards are not "full" of players getting ganked.
"new/casual grouping" is a redundant meaningless grouping made up by yourself. About 1/2 the alts I have, I would classify as new/casual: 1 less than 6 months old, 2 log in to do missions with a specific corporation when LP rewards are right. 4 mine ice in high sec about once a month. 1 I use to sit in orca while ice mining is occurring. 1 I use for personal empire hauling in Fenrir. 1. I use to web/scout said Fenrir. All of those fit into your new/casual definitions. I am not new or casual.
"the easy proliferation" There has been no proliferation. Since 2006 this game has got safer and safer.
"materially harms player retention" Do you have access to Eve Online's unsubscribe data? Do you have access to the account closing survey results?
You sir are too good fun. You're like a 3rd dan Freemason demanding that organisational reform. |

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Posted - 2014.11.06 00:53:48 -
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Hilti Enaka wrote:Murauke wrote:No really bothered about this ganking craze but I will say that to pigeon people by saying they are lazy and should be ganked is a bit tiresome when gankers sit in choke/popular systems and get a pay day for no effort what so ever. Quite like this post that everyone seems to have dodged.
1. All choke point systems can be avoided.
2. Sit a scout in said "choke point" cloaked 200km off gate and right click add contact for all the bumpers, gankers you see over a two week period.
3. Change overview settings to show said bumpers/gankers as flashing skulls in local.
4. Always scout and use webbing alt.
5. Laugh, as by having applied a relatively small amount of effort you have now reduced your odds of being ganked to almost 0. You have forced those lazy gankers to now apply a level of effort that they will simply will not do. |

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Posted - 2014.11.09 19:55:11 -
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Veers Belvar wrote:
Blah, blah, more name calling and immaturity...time to go back to grade school?
Pot. Kettle. Black.
Veers Belvar wrote:
Awoxxing serves as a perfect example of CCP's thinking here, and attempt to improve the game for EVERYONE, not just the 2% of the playerbase that gets its highs ganking and turning eve into Grand Theft Auto.
1. What CCP say serves as an example. 2. What you infer about CCP's thinking, CCP's direction, the 2% and Eve vs GTA is conjecture with no basis.
CCP Falcon wrote: Why should CCP provide protection for your haulage in high sec?
CONCORD offer a level of deterrent just the same as any law enforcement agency, but as with any police for they're reactive and punitive rather than proactive.
If you want your haulage to be safer, bring the guns. If you don't have any guns, sacrifice some of your profit margin and hire someone who has them to escort you.
Welcome to New Eden, you just learned a very valuable lesson in being prepared and covering your back.
Smile
Veers Belvar wrote:
I have been ganked, and survived at least one other gank attempt. Stop spouting falsehoods. I don't haul because of the risk of ganking. My playstyle is affected by CONCORD's weak kneed law enforcement. I am quite familiar with the game mechanics, have studied the issue carefully, and am obviously entitled to my (overwhelmingly correct) opinion. I didn't realize CCP put you in charge of deciding who is allowed to post on the forums.
You are not familiar with game mechanics. Every second or third post from you illustrates a lack of understanding of the implications of specific game mechanics and how they came into being and why they are there. |
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